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Java Forum / Tools / February 2004

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best development JAVA tool

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pmdanger - 03 Feb 2004 14:01 GMT
Hi,
I would like to have programmer's feedback regarding Java development
toold.

Soon, i will have to develop a Java application and i want to do the
right choice before to start.

Which Java development tools is the best from your point of view ?
and why ?

I need to build an intranet/internet java application with database
interactions.

thanks,

PM
Roberto Nunnari - 03 Feb 2004 19:16 GMT
> Hi,
> I would like to have programmer's feedback regarding Java development
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>
> PM

I've been using netbeans for over 2 years now and I'm happy with it..
..but you need at least 0.5GB of RAM and good cpu power.

before getting there I went through visualAge and Forte..

VisualAge was good till you stayed away from GUI design..
Forte.. don't know.. was too heavy.. netbeans was a nice
surprise! Even though Forte was based on Netbeans.. I was not
happy with it.
Shane Mingins - 03 Feb 2004 20:30 GMT
> Hi,
> I would like to have programmer's feedback regarding Java development
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> I need to build an intranet/internet java application with database
> interactions.

There are many many factors in that question :-)

IDE .... The most intelligent Java IDE around --
http://www.intellij.com/idea/

And for a web framework have a look at Struts
http://jakarta.apache.org/struts/index.html

And for Object/Realtional mapping tool http://db.apache.org/ojb/ (just
assuming yr db is a RDBMS)

I am not sure of your background/experience but a good book of patterns that
you may find relevant to your project is Patterns of Enterprise Application
Architecture - Martin Folwer http://www.martinfowler.com/books.html#eaa

HTH
Shane

Signature

"If I say it's grey and has a trunk why do you assume it is an elephant?"

Enrique - 05 Feb 2004 18:02 GMT
> Soon, i will have to develop a Java application and i want to do the
> right choice before to start.

There can be great productivity gains from using an IDE.  But if you
are just starting out with Java technologies, I think it's best to
start with a plain text editor and working with the command-line
tools.  You learn more if you understand the basic Java dev tools and
writing all of the code yourself.
shay - 06 Feb 2004 18:29 GMT
Oracle JDeveloper is a great Java IDE, You will love its BC4J
framework if you want to do database driven Java applications. It
eliminates your need to write all that JDBC, connection pooling, O/R
mapping and more.
It integrates with Struts and gives you an easy visual way to build
your application. Check out the software and demos at
http://otn.oracle.com/products/jdev
steve - 07 Feb 2004 22:26 GMT
> Hi,
> I would like to have programmer's feedback regarding Java development
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
>
> PM

oracle jdeveloper ( preview version, but I've been using it for months)  or  
eclipse, both of which can be downloaded for free.
Kenneth P. Turvey - 08 Feb 2004 05:47 GMT
> oracle jdeveloper ( preview version, but I've been using it for months)  or  
> eclipse, both of which can be downloaded for free.

I should note that eclipse, although great, isn't 100% Java.  It has
platform dependencies.  I ran into this problem getting it to run
under Linux.  It had library dependencies in addition to those of the
Java SDK.  I switched to netbeans and have been pleased.  

I'm new to all this as well.  I've been tossing around Java for a
while, but I just recently dedicated myself to becoming the Java I
should be.  

Netbeans is 100% Java and supported by Sun.  

Signature

Kenneth P. Turvey <kt@squeakydolphin.com>

 Artificial Intelligence Algorithms Wiki
 http://ai.squeakydolphin.com

Jon A. Cruz - 08 Feb 2004 07:16 GMT
> I should note that eclipse, although great, isn't 100% Java.  It has
> platform dependencies.  I ran into this problem getting it to run
> under Linux.  It had library dependencies in addition to those of the
> Java SDK.  I switched to netbeans and have been pleased.  

If I recall, the GTK2 version has various dependency issues, but the
Motif version does not.
Kenneth P. Turvey - 08 Feb 2004 21:30 GMT
>> I should note that eclipse, although great, isn't 100% Java.  It has
>> platform dependencies.  I ran into this problem getting it to run
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> If I recall, the GTK2 version has various dependency issues, but the
> Motif version does not.

It still isn't as portable as Java.  It uses native methods for its
windowing system.  I don't know why they made that choice.  

Signature

Kenneth P. Turvey <kt@squeakydolphin.com>

 Artificial Intelligence Algorithms Wiki
 http://ai.squeakydolphin.com

Jon A. Cruz - 09 Feb 2004 01:40 GMT
> It still isn't as portable as Java.  It uses native methods for its
> windowing system.  I don't know why they made that choice.  

Actually, it's not so much as native methods for it's 'windowing
system'. Rather it uses native UI widgets. (in Most Unix/Linux
configurations, the 'windowing system' is a separate layer)

Anyway, the SWT homepage over at eclipse starts by explaining a lot of
their rationale. That would probably be a good place to start.

http://www.eclipse.org/platform/index.html

Look to the "SWT" page.

Or... at the moment this is the frame's URL
http://dev.eclipse.org/viewcvs/index.cgi/%7Echeckout%7E/platform-swt-home/main.html
Dale King - 09 Feb 2004 19:11 GMT
> >> I should note that eclipse, although great, isn't 100% Java.  It has
> >> platform dependencies.  I ran into this problem getting it to run
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> It still isn't as portable as Java.  It uses native methods for its
> windowing system.  I don't know why they made that choice.

SWT actually has a long history and actually predates Swing. It was
originally created as replacement for AWT for doing UI's on embedded
systems. They later just used it for Visual Age Micro Edition which is sort
of a predecessor to Eclipse.
--
 Dale King
Scott Ellsworth - 09 Feb 2004 21:22 GMT
> >> I should note that eclipse, although great, isn't 100% Java.  It has
> >> platform dependencies.  I ran into this problem getting it to run
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> It still isn't as portable as Java.  It uses native methods for its
> windowing system.  I don't know why they made that choice.

Because they did not have confidence in Swing and its future.  They felt
that a combination of pre-existing native widgets with ones they
implemented for each platform would have more performance, better
behavior, and overall more predictable properties than platform vendors
could get out of Swing.  In other words, they felt Sun dropped the ball
by not enhancing AWT to above the least common denominator.

This was not a theoretical exercise.  IBM wanted to implement WebSphere
Studio using this widget kit, and they wanted it to perform well and
look good.  They could compare it to Visual Age, a LISP critter IIRC, so
they knew could get performance out of an OO tool, and thus that Swing
was not up to it.

Perhaps more important, there were core design decisions that made them
unhappy.  For example, Swing can have every table row provide a
different height.  Thus, to render a table in a scroll pane requires
iterating through each row to get that height.  Many other tools have
just a fixed height, and thus you do not need to visit cells in your
table model until you need to render the row.

Swing has improved a lot over the three releases of Java since then, and
its performance is now quite credible on many platforms.  Further,
performance of the SWT depends on implementation quality and age.  Six
months ago, the MacOS X SWT port was dog slow.  Now, it is pretty snappy.

From my perspective, the jury is still out.  I find IDEA (Swing) as
snappy as Eclipse (SWT), and I like the look somewhat better.  This
could flipflop easily, as a run of profiling and UI analysis on either
front could reverse either the performance or the look positions.

Scott


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