 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
Java Forum / General / December 2007ValueFirst "FAME" Awards for programmers
Excellent opportunity for programmers: ValueFirst (www.vfirst.com), a leader in mobile data services and creator of unique Enterprise Mobile Application is looking for "brilliant" applications from young and enthusiastic souls. The best of the lot who accept this challenge will be awarded with ValueFirst "FAME" (Finest Application in Mobile Ecosystem) Award. For online application Login: http://www.vfirst.com/ValueFirst-FAME-Award.php >Excellent .. scam >.. for programmers: > >ScaMFirst (www.scamfirst.com), a leader in ... >For online application Login: http://www.scamfirst.com/ValueFirst-FAME-Award.php This seems like some 'cheap and nasty' way to get cheap programming done. - The prize money is Rs 100,000 - about 2500 USD. - It is only paid to the 'winner' of the team with 'up to 4' people - no second/third prizes. But already only $625 when split. - No specific mention is made of who owns code that is submitted. What's the bet that ValueFirst will claim ownership? - There is no mention of how/where the winners will be announced (so the company might claim a non-existent contestant 'won', and keep the code and the *money*). - It is asking for a relatively specific, commercially viable product (effectively). Just as a question. Do Indian competitions with prizes have to be registered with a government authority? I would be surprised if they do not, what with India having been a British colony and them taking up (like ducks to water) the British style bureaucracy. Why not just be (more) honest and offer the work on e-lance?  SignatureAndrew Thompson http://www.physci.org/ > Why not just be (more) honest and offer the work on e-lance? I had never heard about that site, so I paid them a quick visit... As I suspected, they are a copycat of the original, the one that has been featured in the Wall Street Journal and BusinessWeek, Rent A Coder. http://www.rentacoder.com Now, *that* is a topic that deserves a newsgroup of its own. -Ramon > I had never heard about that site, so I paid them a quick visit... > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Now, *that* is a topic that deserves a newsgroup of its own. Um. Rentacoder is a piece of sh.t. I actually registered there a couple years ago to try to get freelance work. Unless you're in Asia and offering your work at $5/hour you may as well not even post there. The site is a complete joke. SignatureSteve Sobol, Victorville, CA PGP:0xE3AE35ED www.SteveSobol.com Geek-for-hire. Details: http://www.linkedin.com/in/stevesobol > > I had never heard about that site, so I paid them a quick visit... > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Um. Rentacoder is a piece of sh.t. Of course it is not. It is capitalism in its finest form. Demand & supply in action. The first day I was there I arrived to a most important conclusion, which I would like to share with the readers: RentACoder is a marketplace to BUY, not to SELL (at least for "us" for some definition of "us", c.l.j.p participants) If you don't have the entrepreneur gene, stay away from RAC. -Ramon >> > I had never heard about that site, so I paid them a quick visit... ... >> Um. Rentacoder is a piece of sh.t. > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > RentACoder is a marketplace to BUY, not to SELL I agree mostly. Though has anybody here had the experience of perhaps contracting work out to the 'rent-a-coder' type sites (that they would admit)? Perhaps some work outside your own direct line of experience that was simpler to (sub-)contract out, rather than delve into the details yourself? What quality code does it produce? Is it maintainable? Comprehensible? Well designed? (I have never bought, nor sold, services via. the rent-a-coder sites personally, but had considered contracting work out to them.) SignatureAndrew Thompson http://www.physci.org/ > >> > I had never heard about that site, so I paid them a quick visit... > .. [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > -- I could write a book (well, a short chapter :-) about my RentACoder experience. Let's just say for now that a NG for RAC-type of sites is not only overdue, but discussing such phenomenon in a calm, rational, objective way is a responsibility of any developer who cares about the future of "How Programming is Done" (RAC's motto). When RAC first appeared there was major hysteria in comp.programming. For one thing: how should those sites be called, generically? "rent-a- coder sites"? Like xerox in lowercase? They have been studied by Harvard Business School, I wonder where the study(s) report is. -Ramon > I could write a book (well, a short chapter :-) about my RentACoder > experience. No time to do it? Rent someone via RAC to write it for you :-) > Let's just say for now that a NG for RAC-type of sites is > not only overdue, but discussing such phenomenon in a calm, rational, > objective way is a responsibility of any developer ... Newsgroup and calm, rational, objective discussions? Does not compute. > who cares about the > future of "How Programming is Done" (RAC's motto). Specialize, or better yet, get an MBA and do beancounting instead. > For one thing: how should those sites be called, generically? "rent-a- > coder sites"? Like xerox in lowercase? Programming services marketplace? > > I could write a book (well, a short chapter :-) about my RentACoder > > experience. > > No time to do it? Rent someone via RAC to write it for you :-) Precisely! > > Let's just say for now that a NG for RAC-type of sites is > > not only overdue, but discussing such phenomenon in a calm, rational, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Newsgroup and calm, rational, objective discussions? Does not compute. We can always try... > > who cares about the > > future of "How Programming is Done" (RAC's motto). > > Specialize, or better yet, get an MBA and do beancounting instead. There is a point in a programmer's life when s/he arrives to the realization that s/he will not be able to write all the software that s/he can imagine. > > For one thing: how should those sites be called, generically? "rent-a- > > coder sites"? Like xerox in lowercase? > > Programming services marketplace? No, because it doesn't include the web site based element. We need a term like "portal" with which the reader immediately knows that we are not talking about an Architecture Digest magazine's feature. -Ramon > There is a point in a programmer's life when s/he arrives to the > realization that s/he will not be able to write all the software that > s/he can imagine. All this "s/he" reference makes me think you're talking about a cross-dresser or a transsexual. Just go with the singular "they" as English writers and speakers have done for nigh on seven centuries when you want to use a gender-neutral personal pronoun. When anyone I know is talking about someone unknown, that's what they do. SignatureLew > > There is a point in a programmer's life when s/he arrives to the > > realization that s/he will not be able to write all the software that [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > -- > Lew Many folks on alt.english.usage or alt.usage.english, as well as book authors would disagree with such form. The topic has been discussed there. Some writers simply say "she". I am sure you & I will not solve that shortcoming of the English language. The one that I hate the most is the lack of a plural "you". In the south they say "youse", which sounds funny. Then there's "you all" (y'all), "you guys", "you people". I suppose somebody will say I am a shill for the "Regularization of the English Language League". :-) -RFH >>> There is a point in a programmer's life when s/he arrives to the >>> realization that s/he will not be able to write all the software that [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > there. Some writers simply say "she". I am sure you & I will not solve > that shortcoming of the English language. I'm aware of the controversy. Given that the use of singular "they" dates back to the evolution of modern English from Middle English, and has been used by such notable English writers as Shakespeare and Milton, not to mention that it's colloquially accepted everywhere I use the language, I'm going to endorse the singular "they" and rate the naysayers as prescriptivist dictators. SignatureLew > >>> There is a point in a programmer's life when s/he arrives to the > >>> realization that s/he will not be able to write all the software that [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > -- > Lew Hey, you are preaching to the choir here. I am on the side of the descriptivists. I went to a few lectures given by Noam Chomsky, and even considered the idea of taking one of his courses. I may agree with his ideas about linguistics, but not with his political beliefs. He claims they are unrelated, but I doubt it. -Ramon > > Specialize, or better yet, get an MBA and do beancounting instead. > > There is a point in a programmer's life when s/he arrives to the > realization that s/he will not be able to write all the software that > s/he can imagine. That's not the point. This has nothing to do with realizing that one can't write all the code, but all to do with bringing food on the table. A western programmer can't make enough money on RAC to bring food on the table. This is a general trend in programming in the western world. Since you are so keen on RAC being capitalism in action, it is also capitalism in action when people no longer want to be programmers but bean counters. I am entirely serious when I emotionless suggest that people shouldn't get a CS degree, but an MBA. Programming in the western world is a dying profession. Customers have sunken so low that they accept all kinds of junk and low quality, as long as they get it fast and cheap. So be it. > No, because it doesn't include the web site based element. We need a > term like "portal" with which the reader immediately knows that we are > not talking about an Architecture Digest magazine's feature. I don't care. > ... people shouldn't get a CS degree, but an MBA. Programming in the > western world is a dying profession. Customers have sunken so low that > they accept all kinds of junk and low quality, as long as they get it > fast and cheap. "Programming is a dying profession." "The sky is falling." "Doomsday in six months." "Film at eleven." There will always be a market for high-quality programmers, and people who buy junk then discover they have junk will eventually target some high-quality development for themselves, or suffer the consequences. Not everyone has the chops to be an expensive programmer. Not everyone is willing to pay for an expensive programmer. The question isn't whether programming is a dying profession, because it isn't, but whether one oneself is good enough to be expensive, and can find the customers who will appreciate and pay for that value. Programming will not die until we stop using computers. Even then, I predict, the mentality that makes a good software engineer will make a good whatever engineer, for the values of "whatever" that replace software in the world. There is no evidence whatsoever that computer use will vanish or even decline within the relevant future. SignatureLew > There will always be a market for high-quality programmers, Ah, the classic stereotype "There will always be a market for high- quality XYZ". But of what size will that market be? And who will have access to it? Software development is becoming a commodity, available at every corner in the world. The times when software development needs the physical presence of the programmer close to the buyer and to the development team are already long gone. And RAC provides a glimpse into the future. RAC makes globalization available to individual buyers, not just companies looking for cheap outsourcing deals. RAC allows the outsourcing of even the tiniest of programming tasks on a world-wide scale. At rates impossible to undercut by western programmers. You can see RAC as a prototype of what is about to happen in the future. Not only with programming jobs, but with all kinds of jobs not requiring physical presence of the producer, where there are either no physical goods exchanged, or the cost for the exchange (transport) does not outweigh the savings, and where the knowledge and skills to perform the jobs are widely available. > and people who buy > junk then discover they have junk will eventually target some high-quality > development for themselves, or suffer the consequences. The 99% or whatever takeup of Windows as the predominant operating system says otherwise. People are so used to bad software they no longer care. And when it costs just 1/10 to get a task done (and you do find even cheaper deals on RAC), then you can afford nine failures to get something acceptable. It doesn't have to be good. It just has to barely work, most of the time. Lew wrote: >> and people who buy >> junk then discover they have junk will eventually target some high-quality >> development for themselves, or suffer the consequences. > The 99% or whatever takeup of Windows as the predominant operating > system says otherwise. People are so used to bad software they no > longer care. This begs the question of whether Windows is junk. Now you have to show that Windows is junk in order to support your point. By many standards it is a /tour de force/ of software quality. Even if not, it's a long way to "junk". Perhaps so many people buy Windows because it does what they want, and at a unit retail cost of between $ 100 - 200 US at a very low price point. Maybe Windows is simply good enough for what people want. This would not go far to support a point that "software development is dying". Anyway, as with all binary bets, one of us will be proven correct by circumstances. If circumstances prove me wrong I'll cheerfully admit it. So far it seems otherwise, but past performance is no guarantee of future results. SignatureLew > > > Specialize, or better yet, get an MBA and do beancounting instead. > [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > I don't care. You are making a huge mistake in judgment, or actually: two mistakes. (1) I would never, ever, recommend a Java NG reader to go to RAC as a code seller. That would be a tragic and stupid move. Well, perhaps if you find somebody who wants to hire you but they don't know you, both parties can go to RAC and have a "private bid" in which you are the one and only bidder invited. I am assuming that those brainy computer science students (one of mine was finishing his Master's and writing his PhD proposal in Turkey) don't hang around c.l.j.p and my readership is mostly western programmers. RAC will simply serve as an agent, paying you when the buyer approves. Granted, this is not the common scenario. You are a big shot in such and such, the company is not a cheap slave driver, they just want some intermediary agent which provides a record of the deliverables. (2) But your bigger mistake is that you assume that some pointy-haired marketing guy can be a successful RAC user. You *have* to know programming. You are like a professor there. Those kids are young, are used to only program what they are told, such as homework. They have the energy to crank out code, but they lack the *wisdom*, sometimes they only know one programming language (but they know it very well), in short: they don't understand the big picture. (Hmm, I am not so sure that you do, either). In a place like RAC, you need to have people skills. I cannot stress that enough. -Ramon In the OpenOffice forum, there was a poster who was really upset about not being able to figure out some macro, and he said that his last use of OpenOffice was to write a memo ordering all OpenOffice installations to be removed from the company's computers. Below is my advice for him. -Ramon ps: I wrote "100,000 coders" based on last time I used the site, last year: now it should read "200,000 registered coders". -------------- ctyler: Perhaps you are not ready for OOo, and perhaps OOo is not ready for you (is there any difference, really?). I am a very experienced developer and I can still sympathize with your ordeal and travails. Have you looked at the O'Reilly catalog? Maybe people should write to them telling them that the second a book on OOo is published, we well buy it. IMO and experience, the availability of an O'Reilly (I suppose there are other minor players) book on a topic demystifies it. Good luck and welcome back anytime you are ready to try again! -Ramon =============================================== jctyler: I have another resource for you. Are you familiar with Rent-A-Coder? It is a wonderful site (specially for us who believe in seeing capitalism in action, in its purest form). You can post any type of job you want (I have seen a request in which the deliverable was a trailer for a movie that was already filmed), but as the name implies most jobs are of a programming nature. You will have some 100,000 individuals potentially bidding for your job. In money terms, I have seen jobs for which $7 was paid (a homework), as well as $7,000. You can expect to pay some $50 or even less, in my guesstimate. http://www.rentacoder.com You may make a request for proposal with no obligation. It is Ok, to say: "I changed my mind" and cancel the request. Only after the job is delivered to your specs you have to pay, and the value is the best available. Out of curiosity, I just checked (you can make this type of queries with no obligation whatsoever, just have to register and log in) and I found 80 developers, listed by rating (we buyers rate them -and they rate us), who include OpenOffice skills in their resumes. -Ramon =============================================== This is the full thread: http://www.oooforum.org/forum/viewtopic.phtml?t=66160 > In the OpenOffice forum, there was a poster who was really upset about > not being able to figure out some macro, and he said that his last use > of OpenOffice was to write a memo ordering all OpenOffice > installations to be removed from the company's computers. Dude, who the hell are you, and why do you insist on posting tons of articles about Rent-A-Coder in a Java newsgroup? Go away. SignatureSteve Sobol, Victorville, CA PGP:0xE3AE35ED www.SteveSobol.com Geek-for-hire. Details: http://www.linkedin.com/in/stevesobol > > In the OpenOffice forum, there was a poster who was really upset about > > not being able to figure out some macro, and he said that his last use [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > Steve Sobol, Victorville, CA PGP:0xE3AE35ED www.SteveSobol.com > Geek-for-hire. Details:http://www.linkedin.com/in/stevesobol I am using RAC as an example, because it is the original, the largest, and this is the first time I hear about your site. Didn't you read the words *AND SIMILAR SITES* in my subject line? We are all eyes, tell us: why your site is better? Have you ever been reviewed by - The Wall Street Journal - BusinessWeek and studied by: - Harvard University - other universities Hmm? -Ramon > >> > I had never heard about that site, so I paid them a quick visit... > .. [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > What quality code does it produce? Is it > maintainable? Comprehensible? Well designed? You tell us! YOU are in control. You are the one holding the frying pan by the handle. There are all kinds of programmers, and the infallible Laws of Evolution sorting them out for you... Tip Numero Uno: Make sure that the developer you choose has a good grasp of a language called "English". I have only found one guy that was highly opinionated and wanted to do things his way. I am pretty sure that by now he has learned that in RAC the Golden Rule applies. Developer to Coder: It is MY way, or the highway. > (I have never bought, nor sold, services via. the > rent-a-coder sites personally, but had considered > contracting work out to them.) What's stopping you? Get an account, it's free. Perform some search for the desired skills and background, look at their resumes and previous RAC projects, post a job for, let's say $30. -Ramon > Unless you're in Asia and offering your work at $5/hour you may as > well not even post there. $5/hour? On a good day. I have seen offers of $1/hour and below. >> Unless you're in Asia and offering your work at $5/hour you may as >> well not even post there. > > $5/hour? On a good day. I have seen offers of $1/hour and below. How are the hours validated? If I can get an hour in in one minute, I might not mind making $5 / hour. To justify making only $1 / hour I'd need shorter hours than that. SignatureLew > >> Unless you're in Asia and offering your work at $5/hour you may as > >> well not even post there. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > If I can get an hour in in one minute, I might not mind making $5 / hour. To > justify making only $1 / hour I'd need shorter hours than that. The other posters' comments are misleading: in RAC you never pay by the hour. YOU describe the complete project. YOU specify a deadline (which can be easily pushed back). YOU submit your request for bids. Up to this time, there is no obligation whatsoever, and you can just say: "After all, I am not interested anymore". No harm done. Only when you accept one of the bids you give RAC (not the programmer!) the funds which RAC holds in your account. Only when the job is done to your complete satisfaction they transfer the funds to the programmer (minus their commission). If there are disagreements RAC is the judge, and let me tell you: they seems to have a strong preference for the code buyers - I said it already: that is a buyer's market. One of their strongest part is the evaluations. You have access not only to the details of every single job the bidders have finished (or are in progress), but the grade they were given, and how many times they have had any disagreement. -Ramon > The other posters' comments are misleading: in RAC you never pay by > the hour. I understand that. But my estimates have always been based on taking a specific amount of time and multiplying it by my hourly rate. At my current place of employment, my work gets billed out between US $75 and US $100 per hour. If I try to quote a job based on that range, to someone advertising on RAC, there is NO WAY IN HELL I'd ever get the job. And when I was freelancing, that was what happened... I signed up and discovered that I had no chance of getting anything approaching a decent amount of money for my job. > YOU describe the complete project. YOU specify a deadline Um, no. I am speaking from the developer's perspective here. The client specifies that stuff. And as someone who has looked for work on RAC, my suggestion is: don't. They suck. Even out in India and Russia, IT professionals and developers are starting to get more money than US $1 - $5 per hour. As a US-based programmer, that kind of money is not even worth my time. Rent-a-coder is a horrible choice for someone looking for work, and unless you're looking to hire some bottom-feeder who is willing to give away work, it's not too useful for people offering work, either. SignatureSteve Sobol, Victorville, CA PGP:0xE3AE35ED www.SteveSobol.com Geek-for-hire. Details: http://www.linkedin.com/in/stevesobol > > The other posters' comments are misleading: in RAC you never pay by > > the hour. [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > you're looking to hire some bottom-feeder who is willing to give away work, > it's not too useful for people offering work, either. So what you are saying is that your(?) site Geek-for-Hire is better, right? I looooove competition... (Seriously) -Ramon > So what you are saying is that your(?) site Geek-for-Hire is better, > right? > I looooove competition... (Seriously) I don't have a site "geek for hire," idiot. I don't own or operate a website like Rent-A-Coder, and I'm not competing with you. (So you're Rent-a-Coder? That would explain your coming in here, shilling for the site.) stevesobol.com is a personal site, and nothing's up there right now. The other link is to my professional info on LinkedIn. SignatureSteve Sobol, Victorville, CA PGP:0xE3AE35ED www.SteveSobol.com Geek-for-hire. Details: http://www.linkedin.com/in/stevesobol > > So what you are saying is that your(?) site Geek-for-Hire is better, > > right? > > I looooove competition... (Seriously) > I don't have a site "geek for hire" My mistake. But the confusion was caused by your use of the term "Geek- for-hire" as there is indeed a site with that name. In that case the question becomes: why would I hire you without first considering 200,000 potential programmers? Most of those people are probably hungrier (in the different meanings of the word) than you. A dollar buys a lot of code in those underdeveloped countries. > I don't own or operate a website > like Rent-A-Coder, and I'm not competing with you. (So you're Rent-a-Coder? > That would explain your coming in here, shilling for the site.) Got a recommendation for a site better than RAC? Let's hear about it. I have been known to change my mind. Like I said: I am simply using RAC as an example. In fact, as a firm believer in *competition* (did I say that already?) I would like to see other sites competing with RAC. Nobody wants RAC to become the Microsoft of the Programmers-for-Hire marketplace. -Ramon ps: you obviously chose not to take Econ 101. > In that case the question becomes: why would I hire you without first > considering 200,000 potential programmers? Most of those people are > probably hungrier (in the different meanings of the word) than you. A > dollar buys a lot of code in those underdeveloped countries. So go hire them. If you're so cheap you're not willing to pay for more than a couple bucks per hour, I don't want to do any work for you, anyhow. The overhead is a lot lower in Asia. I'm not going to claim that all of those programmers are incompetent, or even that some aren't better than I am; that's simply not true. I would argue that I've probably been doing programming/webdev for longer than most of them and I have more experience, though. Plus, if there's a problem with your programmer in India, you're pretty much screwed. Speaking as a US-based techie and consumer, I'd rather deal with someone here and have recourse in case they screw up. SignatureSteve Sobol, Victorville, CA PGP:0xE3AE35ED www.SteveSobol.com Geek-for-hire. Details: http://www.linkedin.com/in/stevesobol > > In that case the question becomes: why would I hire you without first > > considering 200,000 potential programmers? Most of those people are [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > and consumer, I'd rather deal with someone here and have recourse in case they > screw up. You are onto something, Steve. You (the guy trying to make a buck, somebody who has programming expertise!) take your pick: For some jobs you need the long term commitment, you need to have F2F meetings, and somebody who speaks proper English. Let's say the hiring company makes the decision to hire Steve Sobol Enterprises. They hire a *company* (granted, it is a one man company) which presumably has the ability to find programming labor. They don't want to go through the hassle of going to RAC, they don't even have to know that RAC exists. If you need something quick (but not necessarily dirty!) something self-contained, some job that you are could do it but -heck! who has the time?- or perhaps it is something that you simply are not interested in learning... Then you use RAC (or similar). You have to know what are the advantages and shortcoming of such resource. Being a one-man-show (like Sobol Enterprises) vs. being able to grow rapidly on demand makes a big difference for the company which hires you. -Ramon > Being a one-man-show (like Sobol Enterprises) vs. being able to grow > rapidly on demand makes a big difference for the company which hires > you. I'm not a one man show, although I do work for a small company, but your point is well taken. There are advantages to going either way. SignatureSteve Sobol, Victorville, CA PGP:0xE3AE35ED www.SteveSobol.com Geek-for-hire. Details: http://www.linkedin.com/in/stevesobol Ramon F Herrera wrote : >>>> Unless you're in Asia and offering your work at $5/hour you may as >>>> well not even post there. [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > are in progress), but the grade they were given, and how many times > they have had any disagreement. You are starting to sound a bit desparate. Are you SURE you are not affiliated with the site? SignatureWojtek :-) > Ramon F Herrera wrote : > [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > > are in progress), but the grade they were given, and how many times > > they have had any disagreement. > You are starting to sound a bit desperate. > > Are you SURE you are not affiliated with the site? I am completely sure. In fact, one day I wrote to them telling them that the site was so slow (they were growing very rapidly and had to switch Internet providers and hardware platforms several times) that they should base it on Linux. Advice which they promptly ignored. There are only two jobs that you cannot post in RAC, BTW: - A site clone of RAC. - Decrypting, reverse engineering, breaking copy protection schemes, etc. Okay, let's criticize them, then. One thing I hate is that coders make a list of their skills so they get lots of hits. Early on, coders listed a few, realistic skills on their resumes. Some of the coders actually gang together (ahh, they discovered specialization already!): one knows Photoshop, one knows networking, they have a Windows guru, then the open source expert, etc. so they can widen the spectrum of jobs. Cast a wider net, if you will. That is fine and dandy. The only problem is that now many of them you copy & pasted the huge resumes and they claim they have every conceivable skill know to man. If I were RAC (I AM USING RAC JUST AS AN EXAMPLE, because they are the only ones I know of, did I say that already?) I would figure out a way to penalize such know-it-all (unless they *really* know it all!). There's more to be written (and I will, you can count on that). -Ramon ... >> Are you SURE you are not affiliated with the site? > >I am completely sure. ... >... If I >were RAC (I AM USING RAC JUST AS AN EXAMPLE, because they are the only >ones I know of, did I say that already?) ... To summarise. - This strand of the thread kicked off with my mention of hiring contractors via. coder-for-hire sites - I specifically mentioned e-lance. - Ramon jumped in with the comparison to Rent-A-Coder, and 'RAC' quickly became not only a specific reference to the one site that two people in the thread had used (Ramon/Steve), but also I was thinking of it (and potentially using it) in a much wider and more generic sense, to refer to *all* rent-a-coder style sites - since it is a lot easier to understand than 'e-lance'. - I was a fool to underestimate the type of reaction my latter comments would provoke, and I deeply regret ever asking. This is not the forum for it. (hopefully) Java, anyone? SignatureAndrew Thompson http://www.physci.org/ A have been a long time RAC user (just a -mostly- satisfied customer, due mainly to the fact that I don't know the alternative sites). I am not to sure of whether I should be proud of he fact that I have a perfect score as a buyer: every single coder I have worked with has given me a 10. A friend of mine says: "You will never be the next Bil Gates or Steve Jobs, Ramon! Those two are notorious slave drivers, if you are getting such high ratings you are doing something wrong". Case 1: I discovered Asterisk, the open source telephone system. Went to their conference in LA, and complained that their software compiled properly under RedHat, but not under Suse. The moderator pointed to the QA kids and they sheepishly looked at the floor and said they only make sure that the installation works properly under RedHat, and that's it. Solution: I found a GNU guru in Rumania, through RAC. Told him to do everything that he was told by the Asterisk developers ("I am not your boss anymore"), and that I would pay (it was the most expensive project I have posted, eight hundred clams) when said developers gave approval for his work. The developers wrote to me saying that Mr. Comaneci (?) did a great job and I paid. Now, Asterisk compiles and builds under all Unixes known to man, but not on under Windows. http://www.asterisk.org I have installed Asterisk-based systems in several states and a couple of countries but to this day I am completely clueless as to the intricacies of configuring 'config', or 'autoconf'. To be continued... -Ramon Here are some more examples of why this site is so great: - You can get a degree without doing any of the work "AKNMInc" is a loser, but want a CS degree anyway. That's easy, for about $10-$20 per assignment (120 of them between March 2003 and Dec 2007). I wonder who sits his exams though? - You can get a job based on someone else's qualifications "qmriis" has been sent a skills assessment by a potential employer, he "knows all the stuff" but is too lazy to bother. Too bad for the employer if "qmriis" actually gets the job. /gordon -- > Here are some more examples of why this site is so great: > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > -- I noticed gmriis too :-) Ouch, well, thats what personal interviews are for. SignatureDaniel Pitts' Tech Blog: <http://virtualinfinity.net/wordpress/> > Here are some more examples of why this site is so great: > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > -- Not to mention the one guy who seems to be creating a spam-site creator. Basically, he wants a program that will create a web-page that seems like actual content, but is just random gibberish. This *might* be a homework assignment, but it could be an herbal enhancer link-builder. Either way, they wanted to little to do that work :-) SignatureDaniel Pitts' Tech Blog: <http://virtualinfinity.net/wordpress/> >> Why not just be (more) honest and offer the work on e-lance? > I had never heard about that site, so I paid them a quick visit... [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > http://www.rentacoder.com e-lance has also been around for many years. I don't even know which one of them are indeed the first. Arne > >> Why not just be (more) honest and offer the work on e-lance? > > I had never heard about that site, so I paid them a quick visit... [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > > Arne According to the Internet Archive, it's surprisingly Elance. --- http://www.outsource2documaker.com Managing outsourced projects ranging from fine artwork and business graphics to website design and maintenance. Free MagazinesGet these publications absolutely FREE for up to 12 months. There are no hidden fees and no obligation. Simply choose a title, complete the application form and submit it. Read more ...
|
Reply to this Message
|
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2008 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.