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Java Forum / General / April 2006

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JSP

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Rune - 01 Apr 2006 13:59 GMT
Hi,
I just got a short contract developing some JSP pages. But most everything I
read on the net regarding JSP turns out to be years old - including in this
newsgroup. Is JSP dying?

/Rune
Roedy Green - 01 Apr 2006 19:25 GMT
>I just got a short contract developing some JSP pages. But most everything I
>read on the net regarding JSP turns out to be years old - including in this
>newsgroup. Is JSP dying?

It is perhaps like the fact that bread is not mentioned on the menu.
It comes with the entrees.
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Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
http://mindprod.com Java custom programming, consulting and coaching.

Chris Smith - 01 Apr 2006 23:07 GMT
> I just got a short contract developing some JSP pages. But most everything I
> read on the net regarding JSP turns out to be years old - including in this
> newsgroup. Is JSP dying?

No, JSP is not dying.  Rather, it's not that complicated.  There is a
natural period after a new technology is introduced during which more
people have questions about it or are struggling to understand it.  
Pretty soon, those questions and problems decrease in frequency.  Fewer
articles are written about it because it's not new.  And so on.

JSF is fairly popular these days, and 99% of JSF applications use JSP,
for example.

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The Easiest Way To Train Anyone... Anywhere.

Chris Smith - Lead Software Developer/Technical Trainer
MindIQ Corporation

What Me Worry? - 03 Apr 2006 17:59 GMT
>> I just got a short contract developing some JSP pages. But most
>> everything I
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> JSF is fairly popular these days, and 99% of JSF applications use JSP,
> for example.

Anecdotal comment about JSF:

My officemate - a seasoned and highly skilled Java web programmer - has been
struggling with JSF for months.  JSF has him pulling out his hair in
frustration.  He was all set to migrate his major project to JSF; but after
diving in for a while, he decided to put off the migration indefinitely. I
don't know the specifics - just reporting what I do know.
Roedy Green - 03 Apr 2006 18:18 GMT
>My officemate - a seasoned and highly skilled Java web programmer - has been
>struggling with JSF for months.  JSF has him pulling out his hair in
>frustration.  He was all set to migrate his major project to JSF; but after
>diving in for a while, he decided to put off the migration indefinitely. I
>don't know the specifics - just reporting what I do know.

I have not used it, but from what I have heard it is a higher level
way of solving problems with a high overhead.  The way you get in
trouble with such a tool is by trying to use it as if it were a low
level tool. You have to do things its way rather than trying to
bludgeon it to do things your particular way.

It is a similar problem to C programmers coming to java and trying to
translate their code line for line into Java.
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Canadian Mind Products, Roedy Green.
http://mindprod.com Java custom programming, consulting and coaching.

Dag Sunde - 03 Apr 2006 23:12 GMT
>>My officemate - a seasoned and highly skilled Java web programmer - has
>>been
[quoted text clipped - 12 lines]
> It is a similar problem to C programmers coming to java and trying to
> translate their code line for line into Java.

Sounds right...

One of my colleagues is a very good C# w/DotNetNuke and VB programmer
doing web-apps all the time, and he wouldn't stop his praise of JSF...

He was completely sold, being used to a portal-framework for .Net up
front...

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Dag.

Chris Smith - 03 Apr 2006 22:43 GMT
> Anecdotal comment about JSF:
>
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> diving in for a while, he decided to put off the migration indefinitely. I
> don't know the specifics - just reporting what I do know.

I don't anything, of course, about that guy's situation, but I certainly
have my complaints about JSF.  I just said it's popular.  I think that
"popular" is quite an understatement, in fact, though the hype has
subsided in the last 9 months or so (whether from lower adoption or just
lesser novelty, I couldn't say).  Certainly there are serious
abstraction problems in the JSF framework, which the 1.2 release will go
a long way toward fixing but won't really get there.  Nevertheless, I
can't point to another web app framework that's not without its share of
problems.

It's also likely that Roedy's suggestion is accurate.  JSF is a rather
fundamentally different way of doing web applications, and if your
colleague is accustomed to doing things differently, he may find himself
at odds philosophically, rather than merely using a poor technology.  To
someone in the midst of things, it's often hard to tell the difference.

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www.designacourse.com
The Easiest Way To Train Anyone... Anywhere.

Chris Smith - Lead Software Developer/Technical Trainer
MindIQ Corporation

Sandeep - 02 Apr 2006 03:51 GMT
> Hi,
> I just got a short contract developing some JSP pages. But most everything I
> read on the net regarding JSP turns out to be years old - including in this
> newsgroup. Is JSP dying?

Visit http://www.coreservlets.com/
Jon Martin Solaas - 04 Apr 2006 12:05 GMT
> Hi,
> I just got a short contract developing some JSP pages. But most everything I
> read on the net regarding JSP turns out to be years old - including in this
> newsgroup. Is JSP dying?
>
> /Rune

No, jsp is quite established. But jsp is often used in combination with
other technologies, like the Struts framework, Java Server Faces etc.


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