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Java Forum / General / December 2005A print() method in class Object will make things a lot simple
Hi, It can not measure how many lines of System.out.println() has been used around the Java world. I think if there is a function like this: public static void print(String msg){ System.out.println(msg); } Inside class Object will make many developers' lives a lot of simpler, do u think so? If you really want this, it is not so hard to add (since 1.5): package print; public class Printer { public static void println(String msg) { System.out.println(msg); } public static void print(String msg) { System.out.print(msg); } } Use: import static quick.Printer.*; public class Test { public static void main(String[] args) { println("test"); } } There, all you want without waiting for a new Java release :) Grtz, Bart Should be: import static print.Printer.*; of course. Well, should be import static System.out.* and then you can use your print without any wrapping :-) > Well, should be > > import static System.out.* > > and then you can use your print without any wrapping :-) No, you can't.  Signaturemonique Ask smart questions, get good answers: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html moopT wrote: > Inside class Object will make many developers' lives a lot of simpler, > do u think so? No. -- chris > Hi, > It can not measure how many lines of System.out.println() has been used [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Inside class Object will make many developers' lives a lot of simpler, > do u think so? I can't see the point of this. Could you show an example where this would be useful? Signaturemonique Ask smart questions, get good answers: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html well, I spent a lot of typing for using System.out.println, dont you? moopT wrote: > well, I spent a lot of typing for using System.out.println, dont you? No. -- chris >well, I spent a lot of typing for using System.out.println, dont you? See http://mindprod.com/jgloss/dsk.html#KINESIS You can program the keyboard with macros so it will type strings from shorthand. E.g. http://mindprod.com I type with Ctrl-E SignatureCanadian Mind Products, Roedy Green. http://mindprod.com Java custom programming, consulting and coaching. >You can program the keyboard with macros so it will type >strings from shorthand. Here are some of my macros for the Windows program "AllChars": jvm=public static void main( final java.lang.String[] args ) jsp=java.lang.System.out.println( jsd=java.lang.System.out.println( "o =( " + o.getClass().getName() + " )" + o ); My macro key is "q", so when I type "qjvm" it is replaced by "public static void main( final java.lang.String[] args )". A real macro processor could even parameterize code, which would be helpful in the case of the last macro above, where the user still needs to replace "o" by an actual reference name to be written. For example, here are variants of common keywords, which are intended for reference expressions instead of boolean expressions and which are defined using a preprocessor. $define IF if(( $1 )!= null ) $define WHILE while(( $1 )!= null ) $define UNLESS if(( $1 )== null ) $define ASSERT assert(( $1 )!= null ) > well, I spent a lot of typing for using System.out.println, dont > you? I would really appreciate it if you quoted the text to which you're responding. Anyway, no. Adding a "println" method to Object would save you 10 characters (not "print" because that implies no newline). Big whoop. If you really want to save some characters, I suppose you could do the following (which, from a code readability standpoint, I strongly discourage): iimport java.io.PrintStream; public class SystemOutTest { static PrintStream p = System.out; public static void main (String[] args) { p.println ("Look ma, fewer keystrokes!"); } } Signaturemonique Ask smart questions, get good answers: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html > On 2005-12-15, moopT penned: >> well, I spent a lot of typing for using System.out.println, dont >> you? > > I would really appreciate it if you quoted the text to which you're > responding. Lately there has been a huge increase in the number of people refusing to quote text while replying -- LTP :) On Thu, 15 Dec 2005 15:23:42 -0700, "Luc The Perverse" <sll_noSpamlicious_z_XXX_m@cc.usu.edu> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said : >Lately there has been a huge increase in the number of people refusing to >quote text while replying Get a newsreader. They are free. It saves having the irrelevant stuff endlessly requoted. If you lose track of context it is just a keystroke away. http://mindprod.com/jgloss/newsreader.html SignatureCanadian Mind Products, Roedy Green. http://mindprod.com Java custom programming, consulting and coaching. > On Thu, 15 Dec 2005 15:23:42 -0700, "Luc The Perverse" ><sll_noSpamlicious_z_XXX_m@cc.usu.edu> wrote, quoted or indirectly [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > http://mindprod.com/jgloss/newsreader.html BS. Conscientious quoting (that is, snipping the irrelevant bits and including the parts to which you're actually responding) is part of being a good netizen. I don't want to have to reread a 500 line post just to guess at which part someone found interesting. Signaturemonique Ask smart questions, get good answers: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html > Get a newsreader. They are free. It saves having the irrelevant stuff > endlessly requoted. If you lose track of context it is just a > keystroke away. Newsreader or not, it is a courtesy to quote the parts you are replying to. /Thomas SignatureThe comp.lang.java.gui FAQ: ftp://ftp.cs.uu.nl/pub/NEWS.ANSWERS/computer-lang/java/gui/faq http://www.uni-giessen.de/faq/archiv/computer-lang.java.gui.faq/ On Fri, 16 Dec 2005 09:05:29 +0100, Thomas Weidenfeller <nobody@ericsson.invalid> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said : >Newsreader or not, it is a courtesy to quote the parts you are replying to. But you have no control over what other people do. As you can see, all the screaming about top posting, multi-posting, too much quoting, too little quoting, trolling and spamming has not managed to come anywhere near controlling others. So your best defense is to get a newsreader which helps you deal with the crap. SignatureCanadian Mind Products, Roedy Green. http://mindprod.com Java custom programming, consulting and coaching. > On Fri, 16 Dec 2005 09:05:29 +0100, Thomas Weidenfeller > <nobody@ericsson.invalid> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > So your best defense is to get a newsreader which helps you deal with > the crap. I have not found a newsreader which can detect if a message has not quoted what it is replying to and fill it in automatically, or correct a top post. Perhaps we can find a charitable, talented Canadian Java programmer who can fill the void ;) I have a few good ideas. 1. A hotkey which attempts to create quotations from previous messages. (Without actually having to load the previous message, leave the current message or look through a tree of read messages) 2. Autoformatting which changes non standard "|" to ">" and corrects loop around when lines have gotten too long 3. Signature randomizer and option to put signature at bottom of post. (Signatures can have simple rules - like an offensive signature would only show in alt.* or more specifically alt.alien.vampire.flonk.flonk.flonk, and "proper" sigs and attribution lines for sci.* and comp.*) 4. Configurable signature clipping for people who have 4 Kb sigs 5. Ability to pass any message to a java function - either to modify it before viewing, forward it or generate statistical data. 6. Check multiple news servers to look for missing messages - perhaps even parse through the google groups notification email to make sure your server isn't being gh3y 7. Multiple methods of newsgroup viewing through a provided GUI, at the command prompt, through telnet or over a webpage. (Of course a viewer java plugin feature would exist that would allow virtually any type of viewer conceivable.) Maybe you could take my ideas and make a student project page out of them (if you think it's worthwhile) -- LTP :) On Fri, 16 Dec 2005 13:26:21 -0700, "Luc The Perverse" <sll_noSpamlicious_z_XXX_m@cc.usu.edu> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said : >Perhaps we can find a charitable, talented Canadian Java programmer who can >fill the void ;) My idea is to use a more machine friendly protocol to track attributions automatically and prevent misquoting or spoofing. See http://mindprod.com/projects/mailreadernewsreader.html If you rely on humans to be fastidious, that is hopeless. SignatureCanadian Mind Products, Roedy Green. http://mindprod.com Java custom programming, consulting and coaching. > On Fri, 16 Dec 2005 13:26:21 -0700, "Luc The Perverse" > <sll_noSpamlicious_z_XXX_m@cc.usu.edu> wrote, quoted or indirectly [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > See http://mindprod.com/projects/mailreadernewsreader.html Ah I had read that already, I should have remembered. I think we have very little chance of updating existing protocols. Even when we do the changes tend be to evolutionary instead of revolutionary. I admit you had more good ideas than I did. > If you rely on humans to be fastidious, that is hopeless. After a quick trip to dictionary.com, I would have to agree with you. (I typically consider myself to have a good vocabulary, but perhaps I just don't hang out with too many intellectuals.) -- LTP :) On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 00:52:14 -0700, "Luc The Perverse" <sll_noSpamlicious_z_XXX_m@cc.usu.edu> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said : >I think we have very little chance of updating existing protocols. Even >when we do the changes tend be to evolutionary instead of revolutionary. It depends on your time frame. Surely you don't expect SMTP and NNTP to be still in use 100 years from now. Things don't seem to change. They get replaced. SignatureCanadian Mind Products, Roedy Green. http://mindprod.com Java custom programming, consulting and coaching. On Fri, 16 Dec 2005 13:26:21 -0700, "Luc The Perverse" <sll_noSpamlicious_z_XXX_m@cc.usu.edu> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said : > through the google groups notification email to make sure your server >isn't being gh3y More dudespeak for the glossary. What is that one? SignatureCanadian Mind Products, Roedy Green. http://mindprod.com Java custom programming, consulting and coaching. > On Fri, 16 Dec 2005 13:26:21 -0700, "Luc The Perverse" > <sll_noSpamlicious_z_XXX_m@cc.usu.edu> wrote, quoted or indirectly [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > More dudespeak for the glossary. What is that one? Uh oh. . . . . um. gh3y = gay, but I was using it as a synonym for "stupid" *ducks head* It's incredible though - I don't MEAN to use 1337 speak in this NG - it just comes out without me realizing. -- LTP :) On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 00:44:47 -0700, "Luc The Perverse" <sll_noSpamlicious_z_XXX_m@cc.usu.edu> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said : >gh3y = gay, but I was using it as a synonym for "stupid" Fighting words Luc. See http://mindprod.com/ggloss/blurb.html SignatureCanadian Mind Products, Roedy Green. http://mindprod.com Java custom programming, consulting and coaching. >>gh3y = gay, but I was using it as a synonym for "stupid" > > Fighting words Luc. No . . rather society's evil prejudices infiltrating my vocabulary. I blame Howard Stern actually ;) (I knew the mistake I had made as soon as you asked.) >See http://mindprod.com/ggloss/blurb.html I would like to get a copy of your book actually :) Is it still available? -- LTP :) On Sat, 17 Dec 2005 12:04:51 -0700, "Luc The Perverse" <sll_noSpamlicious_z_XXX_m@cc.usu.edu> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said : >I would like to get a copy of your book actually :) Is it still available? Even in the 80s it was a collector's item. There is one in the Kinsey Library and is some library special collections. I have only one copy left. SignatureCanadian Mind Products, Roedy Green. http://mindprod.com Java custom programming, consulting and coaching. > On Fri, 16 Dec 2005 09:05:29 +0100, Thomas Weidenfeller ><nobody@ericsson.invalid> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > quoting, too little quoting, trolling and spamming has not managed > to come anywhere near controlling others. Not to mention screaming about SSSCSSESECSEs and whatnot ... > So your best defense is to get a newsreader which helps you deal > with the crap. Nah. The vast majority of useful posts follow netiquette conventions, like including the text to which one is responding (and snipping the rest). Most of the posts that don't bother to quote anything are also posts that I can readily ignore. If I do check, I often find that the poster just replied to "any old" message in the thread. And then there are those who create new threads to continue a conversation, leaving most of us in the dark! There's also the occasional problem of a missing message. I've certainly hit esc-P (finds parent in slrn) only to see that my news server doesn't have that message. A few weeks ago, there seemed to be a problem with posts from google groups getting to my machine. As with most annoyances in usenet, the best defense is simply to ignore. Signaturemonique Ask smart questions, get good answers: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html >On Thu, 15 Dec 2005 15:23:42 -0700, "Luc The Perverse" ><sll_noSpamlicious_z_XXX_m@cc.usu.edu> wrote, quoted or indirectly [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > >http://mindprod.com/jgloss/newsreader.html Two points: (1) Irrelevant stuff is not supposed to be requoted, only the points to which one is replying. (2) I wonder about that "just a keystroke away". I use trn, and I have it configured to retrieve articles from the news server one at a time (rather than maintaining a local cache of articles), so trying to search back through a thread for the replied-to article .... Actually there *is* a keystroke command to do that, but it requires another fetch from the server, and often simply doesn't work. Could be a problem with how I have it configured, could be simply a bug, who knows. Best case, though, is "only a keystroke, and a wait while the article is fetched from the server". Do other newsreaders behave "better" in this regard? | B. L. Massingill | ObDisclaimer: I don't speak for my employers; they return the favor. > I wonder about that "just a keystroke away". I use trn, That is not what I mean by a newsreader. A newsreader maintains a local copy of posts you have already read in the last week or so. SignatureCanadian Mind Products, Roedy Green. http://mindprod.com Java custom programming, consulting and coaching. On Fri, 16 Dec 2005 10:05:46 GMT, Roedy Green <my_email_is_posted_on_my_website@munged.invalid> wrote, quoted or indirectly quoted someone who said : >That is not what I mean by a newsreader. A newsreader maintains a >local copy of posts you have already read in the last week or so. see http://mindprod.com/jgloss/newsreader.html for a list of some. SignatureCanadian Mind Products, Roedy Green. http://mindprod.com Java custom programming, consulting and coaching. >On Fri, 16 Dec 2005 10:05:46 GMT, Roedy Green ><my_email_is_posted_on_my_website@munged.invalid> wrote, quoted or [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > see http://mindprod.com/jgloss/newsreader.html >for a list of some. You will notice from my other post that I had already decided that maybe I should read *all* of the above page before posting a snide reply. Previously I read only far enough to confirm my prejudices, and skipped your list, incorrectly assuming that there would be nothing of interest for a text-mode fanatic. pine, hm .... | B. L. Massingill | ObDisclaimer: I don't speak for my employers; they return the favor. >> I wonder about that "just a keystroke away". I use trn, > >That is not what I mean by a newsreader. A newsreader maintains a >local copy of posts you have already read in the last week or so. Oh good, a newsreader snob. I'd have just said that it was a special-purpose program for reading Usenet news, as opposed to using one's browser or e-mail program .... Something that actually sounds like its meets my criteria as well (runs nicely from the command line in text mode and lets me use my text editor of choice) is pine, which is a mail client .... no, "Program for Internet News and Email". Hm! I didn't know that. (Deep sigh as blmblm contemplates installing and configuring yet another piece of software, and trying to make its keystrokes reflex actions .... ) It still seems a bit wasteful to maintain a local copy of all posts read, even the junk, but maybe disk space is so cheap these days that no one cares. The other option, of training newbies in the customs of the "place" in which they find themselves, is probably no longer an option, alas. | B. L. Massingill | ObDisclaimer: I don't speak for my employers; they return the favor. >It still seems a bit wasteful to maintain a local copy of all posts >read, even the junk, but maybe disk space is so cheap these days >that no one cares. The advantages are: 1. If your newsserver is slow, you can mark the message you want and tell it to fetch them in the background while you read something. Then when you read the news stuff it pops up instantly. 2. you have copies kept as long as you want even if your news server drops them after a few days. In these days of 40 gig disks and DVD downloads the space is trivial. 3. You can use local search tools to find stuff rapidly. 4. you can rapidly navigate to review previous posts if the context unclear. SignatureCanadian Mind Products, Roedy Green. http://mindprod.com Java custom programming, consulting and coaching. >>It still seems a bit wasteful to maintain a local copy of all posts >>read, even the junk, but maybe disk space is so cheap these days [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >4. you can rapidly navigate to review previous posts if the context >unclear. All true. I suppose I grew up in an era in which disk space wasn't regarded as essentially unlimited and so I'm uneasy with using space for posts I almost surely will not want to look at again. Lately I've been keeping my own archive of threads in which I'm participating, and that does have some of the benefits you mention. But it's a bit more work. (Maybe I should consider setting up the "local news spool" mentioned in the trn installation documentation. Hm.) | B. L. Massingill | ObDisclaimer: I don't speak for my employers; they return the favor. >>I wonder about that "just a keystroke away". I use trn, > > That is not what I mean by a newsreader. A newsreader maintains a > local copy of posts you have already read in the last week or so. Since a decade or longer Wayne Davison's trn is a fine newsreader. You have very little chance of re-defining the meaning of the word newsreader to exclude readers like trn. trn is the threaded version of rn (rn = readnews). rn was written by Larry Wall (today of Perl fame). This is all part of Usenet technology from the times long before this web and GUI thing became popular. ftp://ftp.uu.net/networking/news/readers/trn/ http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/help/usenet/trnint-3.3.html /Thomas SignatureThe comp.lang.java.gui FAQ: ftp://ftp.cs.uu.nl/pub/NEWS.ANSWERS/computer-lang/java/gui/faq http://www.uni-giessen.de/faq/archiv/computer-lang.java.gui.faq/ >>>I wonder about that "just a keystroke away". I use trn, >> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >ftp://ftp.uu.net/networking/news/readers/trn/ >http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/help/usenet/trnint-3.3.html Be advised (you may know this) that a more recent (though officially "test") version is available at http://trn.sourceforge.net/ I'm not sure anyone is actively working on this program any more -- it's been years since the last update -- but I've been happy with it. This "test" version (4.0) includes some nice features not in the 3.x versions as best I remember (e.g., a "newsgroup selector" menu). | B. L. Massingill | ObDisclaimer: I don't speak for my employers; they return the favor. > Two points: > > (1) Irrelevant stuff is not supposed to be requoted, only the points > to which one is replying. Agreed. > (2) I wonder about that "just a keystroke away". I use trn, and I > have it configured to retrieve articles from the news server one at [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > and a wait while the article is fetched from the server". Do other > newsreaders behave "better" in this regard? I don't know about newsreaders, but my scheme mostly works. I run leafnode on the machine from which I read news (via slrn). Leafnode acts as a news server that only retrieves messages from the groups you've specified. So I tell it to read from my ISP's server and from gmane. Then it pulls news from those servers via a cronjob. Even if the client has to go "back to the news server", the server is on the same machine. Signaturemonique Ask smart questions, get good answers: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html [ snip ] >> (2) I wonder about that "just a keystroke away". I use trn, and I >> have it configured to retrieve articles from the news server one at >> a time (rather than maintaining a local cache of articles) [ snip ] >I don't know about newsreaders, but my scheme mostly works. > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >Even if the client has to go "back to the news server", the server is >on the same machine. Hm .... One of the configuration options for trn has to do with a "local news spool". It sounds like I could get that by running leafnode. Worth investigating sometime, maybe. Thanks. | B. L. Massingill | ObDisclaimer: I don't speak for my employers; they return the favor. >>Even if the client has to go "back to the news server", the server >>is on the same machine. > > Hm .... One of the configuration options for trn has to do with a > "local news spool". It sounds like I could get that by running > leafnode. Worth investigating sometime, maybe. Thanks. This sounds exactly like what I'm using. In my case, rather than setting a special option, I just set NNTPSERVER=localhost I'm not sure if I'm adding unnecessary socket overhead that way, but it works. I don't know much about trn, but another nice thing about leafnode for slrn users is that leafnode allows you to access groups from multiple servers in the same slrn session. (slrn expects only one server per session.) That's actually my original reason for using leafnode. Signaturemonique Ask smart questions, get good answers: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html >>>Even if the client has to go "back to the news server", the server >>>is on the same machine. [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >I'm not sure if I'm adding unnecessary socket overhead that way, but >it works. "But it works" is a powerful argument in favor of something. :-) >I don't know much about trn, but another nice thing about leafnode for >slrn users is that leafnode allows you to access groups from multiple >servers in the same slrn session. (slrn expects only one server per >session.) That's actually my original reason for using leafnode. And a good reason it is, too. As for trn versus slrn, if you're curious: I investigated slrn briefly a while ago, thinking I might switch to a newsreader that I didn't have to install myself with every new release of the operating system (Linux here). It seems pretty similar in interface and functionality to trn. I didn't follow through because of the just-enough-to-be-annoying effort of learning a new interface. Judging by what I learned in a minute or two of Google searching, setting up trn to work with leafnode is feasible. "FYI", maybe, where the "Y" could anybody later searching archives. | B. L. Massingill | ObDisclaimer: I don't speak for my employers; they return the favor. >>NNTPSERVER=localhost >> >>I'm not sure if I'm adding unnecessary socket overhead that way, but >>it works. > > "But it works" is a powerful argument in favor of something. :-) I guess that was my lazy way of fishing to see if anyone said, "oh yes, you're slowing down your newsreading experience tremendously by doing it this way!" > I investigated slrn briefly a while ago, thinking I might switch to > a newsreader that I didn't have to install myself with every new [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Google searching, setting up trn to work with leafnode is feasible. > "FYI", maybe, where the "Y" could anybody later searching archives. Good to know. I am pretty happy with slrn at this point. I have a few scripts that make my life easier, ie configuring different signatures and email addresses for different newsgroups, messages following up to me colored red and showing up top thanks to scoring, etc. Signaturemonique Ask smart questions, get good answers: http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html moop? <samhng@gmail.com> wrote: > well, I spent a lot of typing for using System.out.println, dont you? To explain a bit more... You clearly are writing code in courses to study Java. In that context, you end up using System.out.println() a lot. It's also frequently used when writing sample code, testing out features of packages, etc. It is almost NEVER used in production code in Java. User interfaces are provided via either HTML/XML/WML or GUI libraries like AWT and Swing. Logging is done with flexible logging packages. Most of the time, production code doesn't even have a well-defined destination for the standard I/O streams. So do your typing, learn Java, and you're unlikely to care much about the extra typing once you get into the real world of programming. Signaturewww.designacourse.com The Easiest Way To Train Anyone... Anywhere. Chris Smith - Lead Software Developer/Technical Trainer MindIQ Corporation moop™ wrote on 14.12.2005 08:55: > Hi, > It can not measure how many lines of System.out.println() has been used [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Inside class Object will make many developers' lives a lot of simpler, > do u think so? I disagree. I simply type sout and then my cursor is placed inside the quotes of a System.out.println(""). Thomas Free MagazinesGet these publications absolutely FREE for up to 12 months. There are no hidden fees and no obligation. Simply choose a title, complete the application form and submit it. Read more ...
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